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Sonoma County. The chosen spot of all the earth as far as nature is concerned, according to the famed plant wizard Luther Burbank Dover's County, with 1,010,000 acres of land on 1574 miles of scenic roadways, Cinema County is rightfully famed for its agriculture. Did a culture, industry

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and recreation as well as for the amazingly successful ethnic and economic mixture of its more than 340,000 residents on for the forward looking philosophy of its local governing bodies. Now we invite you to take a closer look at Sanoma County in the eighties with your host,

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Rich McGlinchy. Hello again, everybody. Welcome to another edition of Sonoma County in the eighties on my program. If you're with us every week, you know that we talked to different members of the county government family. We try to find out what's going on in our county,

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what's happening today and what's going to be happening in the future. And I think on this program we're gonna have a pretty good look at the future. We will be talking to the chairman of the Board of Supervisors, Jim Harverson, and we're gonna be talking about

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a great number of things. First of all, that we want to see a weapon. It's nice to have you here again, Jim. Good to be back. Yeah, it's been quite a while. Yes, and since that time you've become the chairman. Yes, well, it's It's enjoyable. I

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enjoy going to meetings. It's nice toe to be able to set the agenda. So it is enjoyable, but a years long enough. Jim Harbison, ladies and gentlemen, if those of you who don't know him, I think he's getting pretty well known in our county now was

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a councilman in the city of Petaluma for approximately 11 years. He was appointed to fill out the remainder of for a few months of the late Helen Putnam's term, was elected to the final two years of that term and then was re elected to his 1st

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4 year term of duty in 1986. Right, And he is now our chairman. General Street. Different things I thought we might possibly touch on on this program. Certainly the 1st 1 and and one that's all too much with us, as they say, is transportation. And I

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know that, incidentally, and one other thing. Dragline quickly. Jim is the Sonoma County board representative on the Western Omagh county representative on the Golden Gate Bridge district. So what is the current status of planning improvements to one? 01 Jim Well, is an awful lot of planning

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going on. A lot of studies going on. There's no uniformity of a of opinion as to what should be done. Right now, we have every possible option considered trains, additional buses, lanes, the freeway, everything any. While idea that's ever come up has been discussed. We have

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a an organization called the 101 Carter Action Committee, which is studying all of these. It has representatives from all the cities in Sonoma County and Marin County into the counties. Although the agency some 28 8 different agencies air there who have looked at 11 different options,

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we found that virtually every one of the options failed in the year 2005 to provide the kind of traffic flexibility we needed. So we've gone back to additional studies. Now we're looking at two final options. One is a called a rail highway option, which would use

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it sometime. A rail system between Santa Rosa and Sandra fell on the increased How we use and the other is the A bust highway option, which would use increased bus service on and then additional lanes on the freeway. Plus a lot of other peripheral ancillary type

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road improvements would be required. Those are the two that are being studied. Right now. They're being studied extensively between now and the end of July, at which time we hope there'll be one option we think will be the most cost effective. Most likely to be approved

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by the voters in the Net probably will go to the voters in probably 1990 after all of the details have been worked out. I'm not too optimistic that we're going to meet this deadline of July. I just think it's too many political and practical, to say

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nothing of technical transportation requirements to be met on and to many hurdles that have to be going over is just an awful lot of opposition to one form or another. Because we have so many different agencies, each of them would have to some degree another veto

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power over any plan. It will be a tough, a tough way to go, but we have to do something or we will eventually choke in the North Bay. Well, you go to San Francisco and back a couple of times weekly, go to get rid District money

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of us I know from here must traverse highway to the Bay Area. You also come from Petaluma in your home to the board. Meetings and the board area are building, if you will, several times a week. So you know firsthand what? What a real message could

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be. So with that in mind, what's the probable time in which improvements might be available for the traveling public? This couple things aren't going right now. The going a bridge district at great political peril is considering increasing the toll own automobiles in order to increase transit.

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This is not gonna be popular with the motoring public. I can guarantee you right now is a member of that board. I'm one of three from Sonoma County. I have a lot of trepidation about about doing this, but the trade off would be that there would

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be higher tolls for a lot better transit service, which hopefully would keep people off 101 and make it worthwhile people using one on one. That's one thing its own going right now. Beyond that, any structural improvements to the freeway system, Any additional lanes, any train, any

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enhanced bus service on the Northwest Pacific Vita boy will require additional infusion of money. Additional infusion of money is a nice political term for new taxes. Okay, the only way. Barring some great turnaround state and federal government funding of roads. And I don't see that will

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be sales tax, half cents. Improvements would be They would have to be a sales tax half cent, probably in Sonoma County, a full cent in Marin County. They have a lot of problems that would affect us. You know they won't do wind 101 They want to

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do a lot of other transit improvements in Marin County. They were tax themselves. If the voters approved one cent, probably Snowmen County would go for 1/2 cent where a larger county. But we have a greater tax base. Therefore, we don't have to tax ourselves quite as

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much, but that's the sort of thing that's required to do the kind of improvements that I think are necessary and that is independent of existing federal and state monies, independent of local monies that go into transportation and into codes and independent of any money being raised

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to go on get bridge board Sales tax looks like the probable disorder. It's probably the only one, uh, again, if I could divert just a second, I think the state Legislature on the governor have been dead wrong not to increase the gasoline tax. That's a perfect

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user fee in which gasoline tax is used by the motoring public and is turned right around and put into either transit, which keeps people off the freeways and roads or in the road improvements. They have chosen not to do this on. They did related so long

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that in order to raise the same amount of money that 1/2 cent sales tax would raise, you'd have to go in with probably 20 or 25 cents on the gasoline tax. You know that's not gonna happen if they get a nickel over the next few years.

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Obvious. Surprised the state has to start putting more money into roads. I have this naive, quaint theory that state and federal highways should be financed by state and federal governments. But what's happening is we're seeing the local governments through their sales tax dollars in property tax

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dollars, which is supposed to use for state for local roads and local services being used for federal and state vote. I think that's wrong, but that's the only game in town. Jim, what will be done to upgrade the other highways and roads in the county if

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the sales tax passes? If that is one of the things that will have to happen, we cannot say all this money is going to improve. Won it won. All this money is going to go into any sort of mass transit system. A large portion, 25% is

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a good numbers. Any to talk about this stage would have to go to local roads and streets. Some of them would have to go to cities for their their maintenance of roads and streets. I might have to go to counties. We have 1500 miles of county

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roads and Sonoma County. We have ah, big county. We have, ah, a lot of roads. We have to maintain that. It's a sort of commitment that will have to be take taken to get my support for any sales tax, and I think at least that much

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will be required to get the city support and the people. Ultimately, people have to decide this by a majority vote. You know, when we were talking earlier a few moments ago, you talked. That touched, I should say on some other possible ideas is the count of

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considering other modes of transportation for the futures of our residents going to add a little further? Okay, this big plus out there we have over a lot of other areas is we have the Northwest Pacific writer boy. Northwest Pacific is part of SP. It's currently trying

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to be bought by Santa Fe Is a lot of massive nations going on? But there is a right of way out there, part of which has been abandoned and already purchased by the going Gate Bridge board. Someone's already be was abandoned before the going rate Bridge

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board could buy. The section from middle of Sandra fell to Highway 37 is basically up for abandonment, and we are we a group of cities and counties in negotiating to try to purchase this as others become available, we would obviously try to acquire this. The fight

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is over. What kind of transit you would put on there? Would you put buses? Would you put trains? There's a lot of sentiment for a train, and a train sounds so wonderful, but it has a very low flexibility. You cannot get own and off the train

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very easily, as it bus can move around a lot better. But both these are going to study. What are the realistic proposals for other modes of transportation that would be attractive to local communities? You know, you said you're certain sentiment for the train was a lot

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of sentiment, the train. But again, I'm not sure that would work. Just like we have a lot of sentiment for the ferry system that we run and we have any survey reduced. 40 or 50% of people say yes. I want to use the ferry system. We

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have 2 to 4% usage. I mean, it's just it's one of these things that people say they want to do it, but yet they they don't. People tend to get into cars for a number of reasons. You know it's flexible, its power, its individual freedom you

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can do a lot of different things we've financed. I wrote improvements largely through gasoline taxes. We've set up the society, operate with vehicles. It's very tough to change this, and I don't think in a free society. You, uh, penalize people for being a car. What you

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do is you make it much better for them to be on mass transit, and I think that's where we have to go to the train. I say The disadvantage to the train is that under the systems were studying, the only one that has a possibility of

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working is we close down bus service heading south out of Sonoma County. We use buses strictly to feed the trains. Then you get on the train and you go to either Sandra fella like spur in Marin County. Get off the train there, you to get on

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the bus, to go to work or get on a ferry to go into San Francisco when you get there. Because a lot of the jobs are not where the ferry terminal and you have to get another bus to get Financial District, a civic center. I predict

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people won't do that now in the long, distant future. After I'm long gone from the scene, there's a possibility that there would be need for a train service between Sandra Fell in Santa Rosa. And I'm certainly willing to study that. I definitely want to acquire the

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NDP right away so it doesn't go into private ownership, so we always have it for a public transit use. Beyond that, I'm not willing to predict that we could make the train work. But we are gonna look at it very seriously, Jim. As a member of

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the Golden Gate Bridge district, I'm sure you must be concerned with one on one transportation at those meetings all the time, aren't you? Oh, yes. What? We discuss it constantly that you know, the amount of the bridge funnels it all up, right, and funnels it. All

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right, There you go. Get bridge district by building. The bridge opened up the north coast that span the Golden Gate. It now operates a transit service without the use of a sales tax on with no property tax being used for this is the only transit operations

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I can think of. That doesn't of any size that doesn't use transit. Bart, a c Transit Sam Trans immunity. All of these areas use half cent sales tax or property taxes supporting. They're going. A bridge district supports its bus and ferry service through, uh, tolls, a

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surplus tolls and fares, plus some federal and state operating seven. So it's a very good deal from a tax standpoint, And I hope we can keep it that way because I hate to see those tax dollars that some of these total dollars go away and set

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to see us to use tax dollars to on the transit system. Because anything could we need that to build local roads a bridge V Even if it was $2 or $3 or $5 if had to be, that eventually is still a user speeds. You know, you're

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only paying that if you use the bridge to go someplace with your honor and your arm. All right, so I think the public personally, from a personal standpoint, I think I think that is the way to go. And I think you're people are in the right,

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going in the right direction because you're going to have to raise more money from toes, Uh, because people must use that breathe well, I certainly hope you come to the to the total increase hearings because I guarantee you there'll be very hot and they should be.

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It should be a discussion. But before I could support any toll increase, they will have to be some sort of a commute book so that someone who uses it all the time will not have to pay an exorbitant increase. They will have to continue to be

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advantages to saying, having carpool so you can across for free these sort of things we need to do to encourage people to carpool, to discourage them from using the individual car into free up lanes of traffic. That sort of thing that I hope with tied to

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a total increase will make it work What I meant. I mean, that very I didn't mean that quite sincerely, believe it or not, those of us who choose to drive the car, I really have to look forward in the future to paying graters tall was probably

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in this case for the bridge or where highway systems kind of go into the devil quickly to weigh, have there's gonna be half money's gonna have to come from someplace primarily is gonna be those of us who use the highways. I guess I think a user

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fee is preferable to that was a bond election on in the election. I supported because again, the only way to get additional state money into the state system. But it's not. I don't think the most effective way to go. We have about a minute before we

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want to pause here, and I want a quick on quick question at you. What kind of traffic delays would do you see ahead in 20 years? If we don't address this problem, you wouldn't get around you. Simply gridlock. It would be hard. We're not nearly as

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bad as East Bay is right now, but we would be worse in the East Bay. Anyone's been in the East Bay on the commute. Time knows that issue of free roast three way simply stops. How a 24 stops. 6 85 80 They all stop. That's the

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sort of thing we'd be facing here. If we don't do something, I'm confident we will do something. I hope we'll do enough now and make some structural changes that will make it keep working beyond five years from now. Yeah, because we just said used the term

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20 years and they were talking every night. 2007 or eight by Holy smoke. We're talking. We're talking $2005 planning. You have doing the planning time. We've already used up about three years of that 20 years. So we're down to 17 years now, so it's gonna be

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an instant battle. Listen, Jim, people pause here and the devastation bringing the public public service Nothing. But I I want to make this point. When we come back, let's talk about two things. Mental health status in the county. And then I think we should talk about

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our ever popular jail. Oh, hi, Ladies and gentlemen, Chairman of the board. Jim Harbison, Chairman of stealing county boards. Improvised. Harbison and I will return right after this message. What is this place anyway? Let me do it. Wait! Hold these truth, truth, truth, truth. Teoh! What

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is it? I don't want stupid. If we don't end illiteracy in America, it may end us. Ah, Thought from the American Association of University Women. I'm Pat Benatar. I'm a singer. I'm not an expert on AIDS. But you don't have to be to know the facts

00:17:00.230 - 00:17:16.250

about AIDS. All this fear that surrounds AIDS is really not gonna help. What will make a difference is research and understanding. The bottom line is that AIDS is preventable. So please get hold of the fax. Because if you don't know what's going on, it's time to

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get an education. Welcome back to this edition of Sonoma County in the eighties. We feel this is a an interesting program and certainly hope you enjoy it, too. We're talking to the chairman of the Board of Supervisors, just Sonoma County Board of Supervisors Jim Harbison. And

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we've just been talking about highway transportation, especially Highway One on one and the problems we're facing there and will be facing in the future and some of the ideas that are being advanced towards the possible solution of those problems. Jim, as I mentioned before we left,

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is to other subjects mental health in the jail. I'd like to touch on a little bit while our, uh, well, we have time tonight, and maybe the best way to start is what's the picture? As far as mental health is concerned in Sonoma, County. Right now,

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you have to go back 20 years and realize that 20 years ago, most people in the mental health instant institutions were locked up in a very hard locked hard facility such as Napa. With the medication simply being warehouse, the government decides society decided these people better

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served in smaller, more locally oriented community facilities. And you're absolutely right. I mean, it's it's much better from a support system from the patient's position from the cost position. All of these were good decisions, except the state's not spending the kind of money to do this

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that they did at the state level. I haven't passing on the local government. They say that they give us 90% of our budget and we have to match with 10%. We found, in order to run a system that we feel issuing and meets the needs that

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we Sonoma County has to overmatch, we have to put General fund dollars in above the 10% that's required by state law. We have done this traditional. We've done anywhere from 1/2 $1,000,000 addition two million half to $2 million depending on the year, and the projects we've

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taken on this past year, we got a cost of living. Rather than getting a cost of living allowance for all our social programs, we got a simple one time only block grant. We put over half of that into mental health to try to keep the program

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going, do some structural things to improve the facilities, to do some studies and some requirements, or what we call a skill nursing facility, which is basically a nursing home for people who have mental health problems who've been confined by courts and give them instead of them

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being shipped, Omer said, Or up north or something like that to keep them local. So we're heading that way. But as everything, all good things must come to an end and we're looking at a time and the money is simply running out that we don't have

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the kind of money to keep that overmatch going and do the other things we think we require in a suburban county. In budget hearings issue, we will hear a lot of options as to what we should do. These options have been identified by the mental health,

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the department, and they're not recommending them particularly with the often such as closing down some of the clinics in the outlying areas. Petaluma Clover Deo Spastic Post. I predict that will not happen. I predict the board will not allow that to happen for the simple reason

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that they are too important and they are too cost effective. Trusted to do that, they will be talking about cutting down the number of halfway houses we have of people who are out of the real control facility. You're now beginning. Get back in society. That's another

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tough one to talk about cutting. We can cut back, perhaps on some additional staff at the, uh Oh, crested are are acute care. You don't do that. So I have assumed that if we do cut and I'm not saying we are, But if we do, there

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will be some cuts made from various different places. I think the outlying clinics will remain in operation, and I think there will be a general tightening of the belt. We have tried to make some changes by putting this under the ages of community Hospital, some of

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the acute care facilities to try to give the management of a bit of a breather space, and this is the sort of thing will probably keep looking at. We'll cut You. Just mentioned that the budget cuts they may have to consider and may have to come

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up with would probably wound the program less than any of the other things. Oh, yes, I don't believe in carving out big sections of the program and throwing away. I just don't think we would. We would serve the public in that way because we're going to

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see an increase in the number of mental health patients because of their societies just changing its unfortunately families disintegrating to some extent a lot of support groups that used to be there and no longer there. And people are in effect saying, Let government take, take it

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over. It's much more effective if we can catch it early on and get someone into counseling than have someone who has a very serious problem and have to incarcerate him either in the jail or in a locked facility. Both those are expensive to say nothing of

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being very bad for the individual. Yeah, very, very, very bad. Believe me, Jim, the county is providing part of the mental health programs services through the community hospital. Right? Why is that and what is being done and why? Well, this is basically acute care facility, which

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is the smallest portion which has some of the accreditation of community Hospital includes the 30 beds. It Oh, Chris, which is our acute care facility. We signed a ineffective management contract that the hospital is sort of keeping that under its wing as a probably a short

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term trying to get everything back to snuff. We have had a huge influx of patients. We had a lot of problems. There were getting these cleaned up, and I hope that eventually will be able to move most of this back into the mental health department out

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of community hospital right now with more management move than anything else. Okay. All right. We have about five minutes left to us. Human. There's one subject we have touch. I don't know way simply have to. It's in the news, often up. Um, the jail we were

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ordered to build a huge jail that we're building. It sometimes seems like a feudal operation because it seems like every time somewhere else in the country have new jail is built, it's automatically field on. Got probably. But what is the current status of the jail construction

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project here in Sonoma County right now, where the jail is 60 to 70% complete visit, but it is running behind schedule. This is not unheard of in large construction projects, but it's something we're not happy about. But the jail is proceeding. I'm a little less concerned

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about the date of completion, as I am about the quality of work if it happens to be, you know, a few days late. But the quality work is good. We can certainly liver that. If we hadn't have bad quality of working on time, we will have

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problems the rest of the Operation Life Jail, which review is 20 years? So we're staying on top of contractor, mainly looking at quality. That's our big kick. Right now. The cost is the cost. We're not gonna be suck in this game. I don't think of dumping

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more money into the jail where we're spending a lot of money is in programs to keep people out of jail. We've hired a number of extra probation officers to go do what they call supervised own recognizance in which someone could be released early before the trial

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Because most of people in jail, virtually all of them in 80 to 90% are innocent people. They have not been found guilty. They have not been sentenced. Eso under our system, they have a very large body of rights that we must protect eso a lot of

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these people who are accused of crimes. Then they get supervised own recognizance. They're out in a very short string short rope by the probation department. We keep a good eye on him. We have all sorts of abilities to amount of these people. Very seldom do these

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people get back into trouble. Okay, It's much less expensive to do that than it is to lock someone up the other on the other end. If we have someone who has been serving have been convicted and serving time, they can sometimes be let out a short

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period of time early. Is that much of a month early owned there, uh, sentence. But again, with probation very tight rein, we have the ability quite often to go in and do drug tests to do unannounced inspections. Very seldom these people give us any trouble. We're

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looking at other ways. We're looking into electronic surveillance, you know, in which we can put in effect little electronic devices around someone's arm is a bracelet on which we tell people have moved out of their house and effect. Have house arrest. We're looking at a lot

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of different programs, looking at work, additional work furlough programs where people will work during the day and spend the nights in jail. All of these are much more cost effective. There does become a point, however, where they're people you simply do not run out on the

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street. They have not been convicted of a felony to the extent that they would be locked up in state prison. But they're people who are, quite frankly, I mean people. You don't want him on the street. They must be locked up. So what we're seeing is

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our jail become more and more of a small medium security prison. We have a lot of convicted felons there, as opposed to people who have convicted, say, a crime of drunk driving, which is a very serious crime. I'm not No, no, no making fun of it.

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But I'm simply saying that These are people whom you can treat quite often as opposed to a hardened criminal who, quite frankly, is probably allowing just came out of society's here. So that's we're seeing more and more of these hardened types filling up the jail. Most

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of the other people who were on a work release supervise Oh, are pro brother programs that we use which more cost effective but with the long answer saying that this jail when we when we opened it well, yes will probably be very close to fall when

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we open it. And we've added a lot of other capacity inundation in the main jail, mainly through the honor farm up at the airport. We're getting rapidly toward the end of a program. A couple of quick things, Will we? We would complete the jail in time.

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The judge has said Imposed period. Would we be able to do that? And will it will it? How long did you stay? It would meet our needs. We've looked at it from a design life 20 years. OK, design cycle, life 20 years beyond that. Do you

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really don't know? It is modern, A jail as you can get right now is what we call the a new concept jail, which we have, hopefully a lower staff per inmate ratio. We have, ah, mental health facility and you have a hospital facility in there. We

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have a lot of facilities that we hope can take people out of the criminal justice system per se on. So we hope that we're going to provide the citizens Sonoma County a good no deal, if you can. With the jail, jails are not popular things toe

00:27:38.820 - 00:27:50.500

having any any event because you don't see the cost effectiveness of it. And I agree. And that's what we should do. Everything we can to keep people from getting into jail. About 30 seconds. Tell me, what will you do with the old shell? Well, wish we

00:27:50.510 - 00:28:03.120

wish we could do. I can tell you 30 seconds, we don't know. But I can almost guarantee you we will not make it another jail because the staffing requirements are such that we literally cannot afford to operate as another J. We have to come up with

00:28:03.120 - 00:28:16.480

additional facilities. You're not going to solve criminal justice problem in this country by continually locking more people up. We have to get it the root causes. We have to do a lot of other things, and I hope we can do those. But again, that's beyond a

00:28:16.480 - 00:28:31.370

county's responsibility. And funding capabilities. Do the best we can mess with what we have. Jim Harrison. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen. Special guest on this edition of similar counting 80 has been chairman of the Sonoma County Board of Supervisors. Jim Harbors. And

00:28:31.370 - 00:28:45.710

then we talked a little bit about highway transportation on 101 also mental health problems we face and the status of our current jail, which will be completed one of these days. My name is rich with Gina program. It's a no account in the eighties. Be back

00:28:45.710 - 00:29:20.550

with you next week with another member of the county government. Family are related agency. Kill him. So long left. Could help. You know,